Theologically and socio-politically, I know you're not really prepared to discuss a lot of Jewish history though I find it nice that you attempt the topic here and even offer a little slice of the matters at hand in your Exodus reference.
As I've hinted at before, it is interesting that this (often secular) Zionist impulse to gather the Jewish people has brought about a rising of anti-Enlightenment thinkers who battle for control of that very Jewish state. I cannot take credit for the sentiment and am not the first to say it, but in a way the Diaspora made the Jewish people more special and gave them a true identity. Sociologically, Jewish humor developed as a response to their low condition. Existentially speaking, what it meant to be a Jew was to be waiting for a return. And I'm not sure Israel has helped further that Jewish cause per se.
I suppose it relates to the Christian ideas about the Kingdom of God. Where is it? Inside us? Political? On Earth? In Heaven? What was Jesus talking about? Some Jews wait for a military Messiah. Others think it is more metaphor for renewal and change within. I dunno. These theological/philosophical/political issues I think take us down a road to shattered hopes in some ways. Frankly, God is not on earth or, well, it wouldn't be earth. Or, at least not God in the way we tend to think of it...God being everywhere and all.
I guess what I'm saying is that I think the problem with the Jewish state is that Zionism failed from the beginning in a way. You can't make up for the past. (A theme somewhat, since another of your recent entries I think dealt with that a bit...American over-reaction to threats). What's done is done and there is a price to be paid, I suppose. But you can't erase mistakes and wrongdoings. That leaves Israel in a strange position of then existing mainly to fulfill a mission which is largely theological/philosophical. And it has neither contributed to Godly pursuits nor met secular goals for Jews in a meaningful way. Of course, you ask Jews who return and I'm sure it means a lot to them. But it is that weird intersection of Jews as a race, nation, religion, etc..
From that view, it is easy to see why we are such good friends, America and Israel. Which begs the question of whether the US has the same existential problem of failures and aimless wanderings. Good topic though...if only more people would dig a little deeper and try to think about these things.
Note to self though feel free to comment: compare Zionism with failed socialist movements in the US at the same time...movements often brought on by Jewish radicals. Food for thought.
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Date: 2006-10-05 03:33 am (UTC)From:Theologically and socio-politically, I know you're not really prepared to discuss a lot of Jewish history though I find it nice that you attempt the topic here and even offer a little slice of the matters at hand in your Exodus reference.
As I've hinted at before, it is interesting that this (often secular) Zionist impulse to gather the Jewish people has brought about a rising of anti-Enlightenment thinkers who battle for control of that very Jewish state. I cannot take credit for the sentiment and am not the first to say it, but in a way the Diaspora made the Jewish people more special and gave them a true identity. Sociologically, Jewish humor developed as a response to their low condition. Existentially speaking, what it meant to be a Jew was to be waiting for a return. And I'm not sure Israel has helped further that Jewish cause per se.
I suppose it relates to the Christian ideas about the Kingdom of God. Where is it? Inside us? Political? On Earth? In Heaven? What was Jesus talking about? Some Jews wait for a military Messiah. Others think it is more metaphor for renewal and change within. I dunno. These theological/philosophical/political issues I think take us down a road to shattered hopes in some ways. Frankly, God is not on earth or, well, it wouldn't be earth. Or, at least not God in the way we tend to think of it...God being everywhere and all.
I guess what I'm saying is that I think the problem with the Jewish state is that Zionism failed from the beginning in a way. You can't make up for the past. (A theme somewhat, since another of your recent entries I think dealt with that a bit...American over-reaction to threats). What's done is done and there is a price to be paid, I suppose. But you can't erase mistakes and wrongdoings. That leaves Israel in a strange position of then existing mainly to fulfill a mission which is largely theological/philosophical. And it has neither contributed to Godly pursuits nor met secular goals for Jews in a meaningful way. Of course, you ask Jews who return and I'm sure it means a lot to them. But it is that weird intersection of Jews as a race, nation, religion, etc..
From that view, it is easy to see why we are such good friends, America and Israel. Which begs the question of whether the US has the same existential problem of failures and aimless wanderings. Good topic though...if only more people would dig a little deeper and try to think about these things.
Note to self though feel free to comment: compare Zionism with failed socialist movements in the US at the same time...movements often brought on by Jewish radicals. Food for thought.